Author Gal and Otaku Can't Understand Each Other
Avatar Deoxyribo9 6 mo ago
This is a fun looking series, always like the not what they seem type stories.
Avatar kronix 8 days ago
ya like that fucking yuri tag missing jesus fucking christ
Avatar apothem 8 days ago
@kronix Yuri is generally more... mature. "Shoujo Ai" (少女) literally means "Girl Love" in Japanese. I'm not sure what's so ambiguous about that. Honestly if there's no active romance in the manga, I don't even consider it "shoujo ai". Which this doesn't even have romance (so far).

Do note that the antithesis of Shoujo Ai is Shounen Ai, or Boy Love.

Last edited 8 days ago by apothem.

Avatar kronix 8 days ago
@apothem are you implying that yuri tag only given when theres actual graphic sex? we have smut for that bruh
Avatar apothem 8 days ago
@kronix No, of course not. The three dots are meant to add a pause when you read what I wrote, as that's how I thought it out in my mind when trying to think of the right word to use. Mature audience != adult audience.

I'm sure you've read plenty of romance manga that are for younger audience (Shounen, Shoujo). Yuri is basically for the same age group of Seinin/Josei. Which I would assume you can tell the difference between.

Last edited 8 days ago by apothem.

Avatar Pokari 8 days ago

That (i.e. "Yuri" for all GL, "smut" for marking as explicit) is not how the tags were usually traditionally used, at least on Batoto or MangaUpdates (the origin of this tag set).

(Also: Not all graphic sex is smut; not even all gratuitous graphic sex is smut. Smut refers to a very particular sort of vapidity of plot in relation to the portrayal a physical relationship).

There's a long and storied war on the definition of "yuri" and "shoujo-ai" within the scanlation world. Both sides have reasonable arguments coming from very different places (TL;DR: Some want to use "yuri" as it's used in Japan—to refer to roughly all GL—but "yaoi, "shounen-ai", and "shoujo-ai" are all misappropriated loan-words already in English, that have very little to do with the equivalent Japanese terms, and so using"yuri" correctly as a loanword produces nonsensical results if those are the four terms you're using), but the end result is that the tags are currently used unpredictably between different people, which is very unfortunate for people who want to know what they're going to be reading.


Honestly, I haven't even seen anything that I'd classify as shoujo-ai in this, yet? Just blatant GL subtext. There's just barely enough material open to the interpretation that Saotome loves Ten romantically, that I'm not going to consider removing the shoujo-ai tag, but I personally think it's stretching it. Unless someone knows from the raws or some such that either of the characters ever reveal any specifically romantic sentiment.

Last edited 8 days ago by Pokari.

Avatar kronix 8 days ago
thank you for not making a troll post I actually learned something today
Avatar apothem 8 days ago
@Pokari The author only does shoujo ai stuff. So chances are is that there will be something.

Avatar narcissus 8 days ago
Doesn't Shoujo-ai have a pedophilic connotation in Japan? Same with Shounen-ai.

Last edited 8 days ago by narcissus.

Avatar apothem 8 days ago
That's a good question. You could be right; I never thought of that. I did recently read that 子供 (Kodomo/kid) is generally written as 子ども because the 供 character is more for slaves or something (child slavery). It wouldn't surprise me if the Japanese people (or anyone) prefer to avoid saying things that could make them look bad. Maybe that's why in "Onii-chan wa Oshimai" Mahiro says "yuri" for female-to-female skinship instead of "shoujo ai", as well.

Last edited 7 days ago by apothem.

Avatar mikegnesium 7 days ago
Avatar Abedeus 7 days ago

I've seen it written as both, and with the "domo" in kanji more often to be honest.

Also difference is quite easy - shoujo/shounen ai is when there's heavy subtext, hand holding and so on. Yuri/yaoi is when there's kissing, deep romantic love and more adult themes.

This is shoujo ai, and subtle at best. Citrus is yuri. Yagate Kimi ni Naru is borderline yuri (at least for now). Morinaga Milk series are usually yuri. Cheerful Amnesia is yuri.

More or less, the more adult and serious it is, the more likely it's yuri.
Avatar Mai88 7 days ago
The problem about the Shoujo-Ai tag is that readers like these have them in the first place, so their usage will always confuse new readers. As much as I hate it, I still tag our works with Shoujo-Ai on mangadex/mangaupdates, but Yuri doesn't imply it's more mature or anything (you won't find any traces of Shoujo-Ai on our actual website). It's just an unfortunate remnant of ancient history., an excerpt from the Yuri Doctor Thesis by Verena Maser (Beautiful and Innocent - Female Same-Sex Intimacy in the Japanese Yuri Genre for people who want to look up the whole thesis), explains what Shoujo-Ai actually means.
To avoid this confusion of the usage of Shoujo-Ai and Yuri, it's better to refer to GL/Girls' Love since that's what is also accepted in Japan.

Last edited 7 days ago by Mai88.

Avatar Pokari 7 days ago

Whether it's a problem that shoujo-ai "is used in the first place," depends on how you feel about misappropriated loan-words. I'd personally say that it's fine that it has a completely (even eyebrow-raisingly) different meaning in English; language does that sort of stuff all the time.

However—I completely agree that it would be nice to just move to GL and BL and drop the whole gamut of "yaoi" "yuri" "shounen-ai" and "shoujo-ai" tags. (And for that matter move most of the yaoi and the more explicit yuri over to the R-18 section where all the heterosexual explicit gratuitous sex is.)

The double-standards we currently have embedded in the use of these tags, I find kind of atrocious. That the divide between "shounen-ai" and "yaoi" is sexual, but that (to a certain subset of people) the divide between "shoujo-ai" and "yuri" is basically emotional, ends up being super-sexist, even if it might have happened by historical accident.

(Or that "yaoi" tends to be kind of glossed over and rarely lumped in with hentai—nor, for instance, put in the R18 section in mangadex, even if it's got graphic sex galore—kind of as if it's not to be treated as explicit if the intended audience is women?—has weird implications that hurt my brain if I think about it too hard (though I'm not sure whether it's as harmful).)

Last edited 7 days ago by Pokari.

Avatar comedyxtragedy 6 days ago
I read it and honestly confused because there is no sign of romance between girl? I see a manga almost like this, and that manga definitely shoujo ai but this? All I see is a girl as a hardcore fans of idol. Maybe I'll wait for development.
Avatar apothem 6 days ago
@comedyxtragedy The author specifically does Shoujo Ai stuff, so chances are it'll be there at some point. Except her newest series, which is called "Gyaru x Sexual Harassment Life".

But yeah so far the best one can say is that there's more of an attraction to cuteness and friendship than actual romantic relationships.
Avatar CoolOtamegane 3 days ago
@apohtem Please continue, I like this of premise
Avatar apothem 2 days ago
@CoolOtamegane Bluntly put, I am not going to continue scanlating this. As mentioned in the image, I really do hope that an actual group picks it up.