A random Passerby's note to the community, to MangaDex, and to the scanlators.

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Hi there,

over the last year, and especially the last weeks, we've seen a major shift of the local atmosphere towards a weather combination of bushfire, supercells, tsunamis, volcanic eruptions and the rising of Atlantis. I think we all secretly enjoyed a bit of popcorn as shit got flung around and stuck to walls, ceilings and faces.
At the same time though, I really think peace is overdue. From the general vibe I'm getting, there are A LOT of people who just want this over with. Some of the posters in this forum (special callout to @Serelanordir for his great work in this post: https://mangadex.org/thread/93461) have done their part towards this end and I applaud them for their insight and willingness to put themselves out there.

My first message should go to the community, because we are the biggest player in this drama.
Our numbers are an absolutely crushing force and our very human mob-mentality acts as a force-multiplier to our ability to convey our opinion, whichever shape that may take. Because this is the internet, we are awfully likely to just spew the first assholery that comes to mind without thinking about the consequences, because we won't really have to suffer them. There are too many of us for any consequences to stick around, because our numbers represent a business opportunity to business opportunists.
Please note here that "business", while always committed to transactions, does not necessarily refer to financial transactions. Transactions of fame, of status, of consumer goodwill and any other form of power, are viable targets for business too.
In other words, if one scanlator decides to go hops, along with their successful series, somebody will see the opportunity and plug the hole, because they see that they'll get something out of it.
Think about it. What better way of starting your work, than having everybody stroke your ego, because you replaced a hated group and graciously offered what they took away?
Don't worry about it though, this is human nature and therefore entirely natural to us. I mean, why would anybody waste their time scanlating anything for us, if they didn't get something out of it? How would that be fair? (Clarity: I'm perfectly fine with this. I know and use this to get what I want myself. Everybody does, literally, from the time they were children.)
I just want you to realize what kind of creatures we humans are, and to incorporate that understanding into your decision-making processes, for the sake of maturity.
Please, dudes, think about what you're posting. Think about the shitstorm your post is going to kick lose, if another 999 people post the exact same thing you just did. We have the powers of numbers. Don't underestimate that power, understand how easily this power can mess everything up. We have a responsibility too, and the damage our collective ignorance causes is enormous.

My second message should go to MD, because you have control that you are unwilling to admit to.
Generally I like you guys. You've overall done a great job at MD and there is definitely a reason there are so many of us. You've got the numbers of how many of us there are, but because they only recently got so big, you probably haven't understood the magnitude of it all just yet. It looks to me like you're still stuck in the mindset of a small aggregator site, thinking that if you shook your stick, not much would happen because you haven't realized how big it is. Your technology has caught up to your user numbers, but your diplomacy department certainly hasn't. You need to grow up and see the power you have and admit to it. Your irresponsibility allowed much of this to happen. You cannot allow yourself to remain ignorant of this. I know, it's like herding cats, but you do have control over us. Your statements carry weight, don't pretend they don't.
With that weight comes the ability to put out fires faster than ANYBODY ELSE on this site. Use it. You are humans, the same transactional rules that apply to us (the community), apply to you too. If you can prove your maturity, you will be granted respect and status by the masses. You were given much of it simply by being MD, but there is more to be had. Get it. Learn diplomacy. Use the tactic of turning the other cheek to win a bigger bottom line (this is called diplomacy).

My final message goes to the scanlators, because you're not the victims either.
With every choice comes a cost, and you offloaded most of it on the unrelated. (Intentional non-use of "innocent". Hard to be innocent with feces on faces.)
You too have power, as the ones offering services. The human mind assigns values to everything and always creates contracts, even if doing so is unjust. One such unjust contract is the very human entitlement. "You've given me 50 chapters of this, so I have a right to more of it, because I gave you my attention."
It's bullshit, but you can't escape it. It works the same way that conclusive action does. If you put money in a vendor machine, you enter a contract with the company that put it there, to give you what you want to buy in return. This makes sense, but you still rely on the company to actually hold up their side of the contract, with no ability to test ahead of time whether they will do so.
Maybe the example with the vending machine doesn't make sense to you, because you're not getting actual money from (most) of us. But, may I remind you, financial transactions are just one possible form of transaction. Attention is also a viable currency, because getting some of it leads to getting more of it.
You may not consider all of this just or fair, but by pulling your translations, especially with no warning to most of us, you basically broke contract and incensed those of us, who just follow societal rules without thought. I personally do think, and as a result don't care, because I know that somebody else is going to see the opportunity and step in to replace you to take that value for themselves. Most consumers don't think that far, or at least ignore that thought while starting the shitstorm.
This is your power. You have the finger on the trigger and the ability to kick off a shitstorm at any time. Don't use it, because once the feces start flying, they'll stick to all the faces. (Clarity: The ability to kick of shitstorms is connected to your ability to pull chapters. It's your nuclear option. Don't wanna hit that button, if you're not prepared for the consequences of excretions on all the faces.)
 
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dude.. wth are you talking about. if it all about jb drama mehh it's all JB and co the one not mature enough!
 
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At the same time though, I really think peace is overdue. From the general vibe I'm getting, there are A LOT of people who just want this over with.
I guess you're not one of those people, otherwise you wouldn't makes this post to stir things up again. Or at least would have done this earlier, when the drama was still fully going on, not now when things are winding down. It's not like you're saying anything that hasn't been said already.
 
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@qstars The whole JB thing is just one instance of the bigger issue. I'd like to do what I can to prevent a recurrence.

@Gian I sure am one of those people. My post isn't designed to keep the current drama going, it's designed to prevent the next one. That can't happen if nobody learns from this one.
 
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I believe the sentiment here is that the issue was throughly discussed. There are many threads about the overall interchange. Let’s just leave it be. If another issue arises again, then let staff handle it.
 
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@PaterFrog If it was still fresh i would type a huge answer reply. I'm over the drama right now. I have nothing against any of the sides in question.
 
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@LowSanity that's perfectly fine. I wasn't looking to start a huge discussion either, but I do want people to think about it, so they won't just repeat the same actions the next time something like this pops up.
 
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People, take note this is a message to MD and the scanlators from a third party, he/she’s just stating their opinions, and is clarifying the topic at hand as it closes down so don’t misunderstand this as someone trying to respark it.

That aside at least this hell of a **** storm is over with~ time to enjoy and get back to daily activities people~
 
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@PaterFrog And you think that this thread will prevent the next drama? Because if you do, you're wrong. When the next fallout occurs nobody will care for what you said here, nobody will even know about it. qstars is right, you can't do anything about it. If internet drama were so easy to ward off, it wouldn't happen all the damn time.
 
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@Gian Luckily that is incorrect, as the recent shitstorm(s) were always escalated by a single person. If this post reaches that single person that would make the fatal decision the next time, and convinces them to stop and think first, I've done my job. Meanwhile, if somebody reads what I've written, gets what I'm getting at and maybe uses it to his or her own advantage, all the more power to them.

@Fuko I guess the tl;dr version would be "ppl r dum, brain OP"
 
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@Fuko
An agressive push at a middle ground of blaming the community, scanlators, and mangadex.

I wish I had the 2 minutes of my life that I used reading this back.
 
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this is why I prefer face to face conversations to properly express myself, but this sure has degraded quite a tad.
 
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@Phaestos It's kind of sad, how people attack those that attempt to make the world a better place, but then people hate hearing the truth. They can't stand it and any excuse to hide the issues will suffice.
 
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@PaterFrog,
well... ignorance is bliss afterall, as long as the problems don’t directly affect us we tend to pretend it isn’t there~
 
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@PaterFrog...

First off, this is a great essay. (Well... truth be told, I thought it was a bit too self-consciously goofy here and there - it felt like some of the bits - like the COOKIE DOWN YOUR MOUTH HOLE bit - were a bit too contrived and went on a bit too long. But that's ultimately just a matter of technique, and the opinion of a writer who tends to be both pretentious and overly dry, so do with it as you will). Anyway - the concept behind it and some of the observations you made along the way are very appropriate and timely, and broadly, you covered a lot of things that definitely should be heeded both by those who are prone to drama in general and by those who took an active part in creating and/or furthering this specific one.

I'd say though that the responses you've gotten are a pretty clear indication that it's likely not going to accomplish much (and were, to me, cynically unsurprising). Yes- it's possible that a handful of people who have notable potential for starting the next drama might think twice before doing so, but the plain truth is that dramas happen because most people, and most notably those who come along after one starts and interject, tend not to take nuanced views of... well.... pretty much anything. People like simple, binary conceptions, where there's one side that's completely and entirely right (not coincidentally their own) and there's only one other side and it's completely and entirely wrong. Most of reality doesn't actually work that way, but their preference for the notion that it does is so strong that they don't let that stop them from pretending that it actually does.

So when you come along and make a sound case for each and all sharing at least some measure of blame, you directly contradict their preferred bit of make-believe. And in fact, in some ways you're actually even more of a problem for them than their equal and opposite numbers on the other side of the drama. At least those people, hostile though they might be and much though the drama junkie might hate them, are playing a beneficial role - there can't be a simply black and white, good and evil drama unless someone's willing to take the role of the opposition. So in a way, the two sides are really almost like allies, working together to pursue their shared preference for self-affirming righteous anger and shit-flinging. And as far as that goes, you're actually something of an enemy to both sides. If they're at all rational, the individuals who are involved in this sort of drama have to justify their actions to themselves, and they do that by contrasting themselves against the people on the other side of their simple binary divide. They don't have to actually be decent or reasonable - they just have to be, in their own minds, less bad than the opposition. But then you come along and call into question the decency and reason of everyone involved, and that's something they can't even really consider. So, predictably, they lash out.

And note that nobody's argued against any specific assertions you made. Instead, they've just tried to broadly dismiss you and your post. That's because they likely can't really argue against any of your specific assertions - they'd just rather not consider them at all, because they happen to like seeing themselves as entirely and completely noble and perfect and someone else as entirely and completely horrible and wrong, and they happen to like indulging in righteous anger, and they happen to like flinging shit, and thinking too much about the presumptions they make along the way to all of that self-indulgence would only get in the way.

Or more simply and to the point, the exact thing that you're trying to accomplish here - to make it such that some number of people stop and think before they start fanning the flames of drama yet again - is the exact thing that that many of them most want to not do.

Still though - it was a noble effort, and your points appear to be mostly accurate, well-presented and well-argued, so kudos. And there's at least some chance that a few people here and there will get something out of it, and at least they won't be quite so prone to play such a part in the next drama. Just try not to let it get to you that it likely won't accomplish much overall other than trigger some amount of seemingly inexplicable derision. It's just generally the case with this sort of thing that if you're saying something that needs to be said, it's something that some number of people really don't want to hear.
 
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@PaterFrog "but then people hate hearing the truth"

Not really, no. It's just that, after all that's been said and shown, I don't really care about this anymore.
Any kind of pandering and/or admonishing essay that doesn't really add anything is just making me tired instead.
 

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