Fallen Angels +132
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Leader: iZN
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Description
We're no longer uploading our latest chapters here. Please read it on our site: https://manga.fascans.com/

RSS: https://manga.fascans.com/feed

Note:
Following a request from this group, all their non-joint chapters have been removed for now.

For more information, please contact the group directly.
- MangaDex Staff

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ixlone
Administrator
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I'm locking this thread down. It is descending into just bickering.

We have clarified our rules in Plykiya's post: https://mangadex.org/thread/4462/2/#post_181344 Should any Group Leaders need further clarification please feel free to contact one of our staff members on Discord.

It's unfortunate that we don't see eye to eye with FA on this matter, but we respect your position and right to not post your releases here.

Thanks for the time you did post here up till now.

ixlone

Last edited 8 mo ago by ixlone.

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^^^^^^^
Deaf Ears ladies and gentleman.
Zephyrus
Forum Moderator
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@_das
At the time of this post, we have 5,921 groups on MangaDex. And to my knowledge, only 5 or less have actually had issues with MD and have pulled out. You're in a very vocal minority of MD being the big bad when we obviously aren't.

Bye Felicia.

Last edited 8 mo ago by Zephyrus.

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@Xunder

Read my posts and you’ll see my point. I’m done trying to explain it to MangaDex’s deaf ears. Hopefully they’ll listen before more groups leave but that likely won’t happen.

Last edited 8 mo ago by _das.

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@_das What's your point? Is it MangaDex says they're better than aggregators and actually are not? Is MangaDex says something and does something else? Please explain your point so us plebs can understand.
Zephyrus
Forum Moderator
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What mark is that?

Is it the one where we keep chapters hostage? Is it the one where we refuse to work with groups? Is it the one where we harassed EGS? Is it the one where we refused to honor FA's wishes? Is it the one where we declare groups dead just to keep their chapters?

We have refuted each and every one of your points with evidence that we're not as bad as you're trying to make us out to be, not to mention how hypocritical your behavior is now compared to before you were punished for your actions not too long ago. You're only anti-MD now because you've made every effort to burn bridges with us by whispering into the ears of groups behind our backs.

Just stop, das. No one with an ounce of logic or reason will believe you unless they want to. No one's buying your rhetoric or your dignified, wounded act.
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No, you guys just completely missed the mark on what I was saying, a seemingly common occurrence nowadays.

Last edited 8 mo ago by _das.

Zephyrus
Forum Moderator
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@_das
So in other words, you've resorted to memes because you can't be bothered to acknowledge @Plykiya 's post.

Masterful debating tactics.

Last edited 8 mo ago by Zephyrus.

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Plykiya
Public Relations
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@_das

Normally joining group discords is great. However, MangaDex staff joins them only when certain groups wish to take their releases down. Easy Going Scans was talked to multiple times by at least 3 different staff members. Their stance didn’t change yet MangaDex continued to harass them. You didn’t talk to One Snowshoe or Fallen Angels. Perhaps it’s because their release count was too low for MangaDex to bother.


I guess talking like staff for MangaDex wasn't enough, now you're trying to represent the opinions of Easy Going Scans? The reason we went over to Easy Going Scans was to apologize for Holo's mistake in his early days for ignoring their email among the hundred thousand other emails (not an exaggeration) he's received and also to try and salvage whatever relationship we could from the damage you've been causing.



I don't know what you consider harassment, but an apology letter sure isn't one. Are you going to bring up how it took two days to remove their chapters?
We waited one day to make sure we heard Ell's response because that's what we do, we communicate with groups and make sure to clear up any misconceptions there are.



We were waiting on the second day for Holo to come back from IRL because he had things to do with his family. But I guess you've been trying to spin it as if we had no intentions of listening to their request.



Or maybe you're going to bring up how I offered them wordpress hosting and how I left out the detail that it'd be in exchange for hosting their chapters?



I asked Ell who I should actually contact about it since she wasn't interested in discussing it. I laid out the offer in full detail to Gapan, who Ell told me to talk to instead of her since she wasn't involved in the web hosting. If she didn't want the offer, she wouldn't have told me who to talk to.






Gapan, by the way, had no issues with the offer and said he would share our offer in full detail to the other staff members. He even liked what we were doing. I don't see any information I left out, the only reason you would think it's left out is because you aren't a staff member for EGS who has access to their staff channel. You're just trying to fish for any public information that you can get your hands on so that you can leave out any kind of context you can to make us seem like we don't care about groups.

Oh, and there are even members of EGS who want to upload things to MangaDex. But I guess you'll leave out that information as well to make it seem like all of EGS hates MangaDex.

Zephyrus
Forum Moderator
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@_das
What you mean to say is "I'm grasping at straws so I'll just bow out before I'm called out on more of my bullshit."

It's not our job to prove anything. You made the accusations. You started this "MangaDex is the Great Satan!" stuff. It's up to you to present evidence that we're in the wrong. All you've done is spew rhetoric but haven't provided one ounce of proof beyond your word, what little that is worth to those who truly know you, that we've done all of these terrible things that you've said we have.

@Plykiya will be posting some clarifications. Feel free to continue to not post before you dig your hole any deeper.

Last edited 8 mo ago by Zephyrus.

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@Zephyrus

Having three different staff members contact the group over the same issue over the span of months isn’t harassment to you?

To the claim that I’m doing shady stuff: I’m not running MangaDex. I have nothing to prove here. It is your job to prove that you truly act in the scanlators interests. With the rate at which groups are leaving, you are clearly failing :)

I am assuming you mean the mess Holo caused with EGS. Evidently, you’re either misinformed or just willfully ignorant.

I see no evidence that I am speaking half truths or lies. The only half truth I saw in the EGS discord is when Plykiya offered them hosting but neglected to mention the requirement for the chapters to be hosted on MangaDex for them to truly have no server costs. But whatever helps you sleep at night I suppose.

You gave EGS the honor of talking to them, even attempting to persuade them over the span of months to change their mind. Not affording other groups that same opportunity of you reaching out first seems to me like it’s a little biased. The only thing I can think of is that EGS had a lot of releases while FA and One Snowshoe did not (comparatively).

Blaming me for messes I didn’t create is very professional of you.

I won’t respond to any other posts. I’ve made my point. Good luck!

Last edited 8 mo ago by _das.

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@_das Holo only did that as he was fishing to see which IPs were suspicious and which were not, so if they were a scrapper from another site, he could block that IP address.
Zephyrus
Forum Moderator
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@_das
@Zephyrus

So, you agreed with me that the channel is not accessible to PUs as you had initially claimed. Nice refutation.

Never implied that you were making it up. Merely pointing out the convenience of posting from a channel that only select people can access.

Normally joining group discords is great. However, MangaDex staff joins them only when certain groups wish to take their releases down. Easy Going Scans was talked to multiple times by at least 3 different staff members. Their stance didn’t change yet MangaDex continued to harass them. You didn’t talk to One Snowshoe or Fallen Angels. Perhaps it’s because their release count was too low for MangaDex to bother.

Come back when you know what a refutation is.


Fair enough. I hadn't realized that this was from the old PU chat until I asked @Plykiya about it.

Are you asking for us to open up the old PU archives for people to view those logs? Because I'll be more than glad to ask Holo to do that if it'll keep you from continuing to imply that we have something to hide. We're not doing shady stuff here, das. You are.

In what world is conversation between group members harassment? Please, post it. Post everything. Let's see the screenshots of "harassment". That's because there was no harassment whatsoever and you didn't post screenshots of it because it doesn't exist.

It has always been MD policy to let groups come to us if they have concerns or questions. You know why we reached out to EGS? Because we felt we had to defend ourselves from your half-truths and outright lies. Some advocated against even giving you the satisfaction of responding to your butthurt antics but other staff and I disagreed. So we sent @Plykiya to try and clear up the mess you caused and keep what chapters that were still on MD. Unfortunately that didn't work out, but we took down EGS's non-joint chapters as soon as it was requested of us and @Holo was available to do so.

And you wanna know why we took down Fallen Angel's chapters? Because we were *asked* to, like we have been telling groups they need to do in a million different places on both Discord and the forums:



Man, all that not talking to Fallen Angels really helped us figure out what they wanted.

The only thing holding One Snowshoes back is One Snowshoes.
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@Xunder

Holo was the first person to post a link to the anthology. There are also multiple times where Holo congratulated the people running the KissManga troll chapter.

Unless Holo isn’t staff, MangaDex staff definitely supported those :)

Last edited 8 mo ago by _das.

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@Zephyrus

So, you agreed with me that the channel is not accessible to PUs as you had initially claimed. Nice refutation.

Never implied that you were making it up. Merely pointing out the convenience of posting from a channel that only select people can access.

Normally joining group discords is great. However, MangaDex staff joins them only when certain groups wish to take their releases down. Easy Going Scans was talked to multiple times by at least 3 different staff members. Their stance didn’t change yet MangaDex continued to harass them. You didn’t talk to One Snowshoe or Fallen Angels. Perhaps it’s because their release count was too low for MangaDex to bother.

Come back when you know what a refutation is.
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@_das Those toll chapters you mentioned being uploaded as an obsession with the other aggregators all stemmed from readers on the AniDex discord server and actually were not encouraged by staff. The staff actually treat the troll chapters like any other troll report and delete them. The Anti-KissManga Anthology was made by a reader to put successful trolls there instead of deleting them.
Zephyrus
Forum Moderator
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@_das
Once again, you're omitting context in an effort to make us look bad. Those quotes in question are from the old Power Uploader channel that we removed from service after it was discovered that we had a serial leaker.

For our other readers, PU chat is a place where, aside from shit posting, staff converses with members of MD who have contributed a minimum of 500 chapters to MD to get their feedback on possible policies and current issues. We removed the old channel from service because there was a lot of discussion in the early days when we were forming policy that could be taken out of context by the leaker and used to make us look bad for giggles.

So again, don't try to imply that we've made this stuff up. I'll gladly open it back up from archives to prove it if I need to.

And is there something wrong with being in Discords of other groups? If you aren't in our Discord (which I sincerely doubt) you have people informing you of what's going on. Why are we in the wrong for doing something that yourself and other members of scanlator groups do as well? For that matter, please explain just why it's a bad thing to want to open a dialogue with groups. Of course we want to keep as many chapters as we can, but we ultimately accept and respect scanlator decisions, even if we don't like it.

As for the attempt to make it look like we have refused to take chapters down, we have not officially heard from anyone at OSS. They want their chapters down? They need to officially contact staff either on Discord, on MD forums, or via MD PM. That's it. Super simple. Not at all difficult. We don't deal with middlemen or random people claiming to speak on a group's behalf.

Have a great day and please come back with an argument that isn't easily refuted.

Last edited 8 mo ago by Zephyrus.

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@Holo

Come back when the benchmark for being scanlator-friendly is not just being better than KissManga. This obsession with other aggregators is getting so ridiculous that creating bait chapters is now encouraged by MangaDex staff.

https://mangadex.org/title/30369/anti-kissmanga-anthology

2.3.5 Joke or troll releases are not allowed, except on April 1st.


Rules are always followed here at MangaDex :)

@Zephyrus

Just confirmed with one of the Power Uploaders on Discord and no, that channel is not accessible to them. Only staff can see that channel. "Miss me with that weak crap."

Clearly MangaDex is monitoring One Snowshoe's Discord as proven by the screenshot you provided. Perhaps you could give them the same treatment you did with EGS where you and Plykiya joined a day after they announced they were taking down the chapters. For them, you made a whole PR move seemingly only for the purpose of keeping their 6000+ releases up.



Have a nice day~
Zephyrus
Forum Moderator
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@_das
Stop implying that we doctored that chat because it's in a channel only Power Uploaders and staff have access to. That's one of the privileges you lost on Discord though you've retained on the site.

Miss me with that weak crap. It's a sad attempt to refute these pretty ugly things you said about scanlation groups. The length of time involved does not excuse your hypocrisy now.

As for One Snowshoe, they've run out of excuses. There has been no attempt at official contact by them other than through middlemen and randos, to my knowledge. If they want their chapters down, they can contact staff either on here via PM or on Discord. If they have done so, they're welcome to submit screenshots as proof. But they don't exist because it didn't happen.

We don't take chapters down at the behest of random people on the internet and groups should be glad of that.

Last edited 8 mo ago by Zephyrus.

Holo
Administrator
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So, MangaDex is no different from other aggregators in regards to respecting scanlators.


Come back when you manage to get all of EGS and FA's chapters removed from kissmanga, mangafox and mangarock...
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@Zephyrus

>posts screenshots from nearly four months ago in an archived chat that nobody other than staff has access to

Alright.

MangaDex actively knows One Snowshoe wants their chapters taken down and refuses to take them down.

https://mangadex.org/group/111/one-snowshoe

Interesting how I deleted those chapters that I uploaded but they mysteriously got restored and reassigned to the MangaDex account. I wonder who has the power to do that...

"We bent over backwards to compromise for groups not happy with our rules."

Last edited 8 mo ago by _das.

Zephyrus
Forum Moderator
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@_das
You're not even trying anymore. You're just trotting out the same old lines over and over and over again. Last I recalled, aggregators don't take down chapters when requested. I'd like to see groups get their stuff taken down from KissManga, MangaFox, or whatever.

We bent over backwards to compromise for groups not happy with our rules. Sadly, said groups aren't happy still. That's their choice. We aren't Batoto and have no intention of asking "How high?" when groups tell us to jump.

In short, stop trying to demonize MangaDex when everyone here knows very well just how unlike your standard, uncaring aggregator we are. It's a testament to our desire to support scanlators that we give them the ability to control their content to the extent that we do.

You're deliberately spreading misinformation and attempting to start a campaign of hate because you're mad about how your behavior, after being dismissed for months due to your contributions to MD, was finally punished and you were stripped of your privileges.

Lastly, don't pretend like you're a champion of scanlators now when a short time ago, you were all for not respecting their rights.

What you've said recently:



What you've said not too long ago:





Hypocritical much? What you've said in MangaDex Discord doesn't jive with what you're telling groups that you were talking tough about not too long ago.

Last edited 8 mo ago by Zephyrus.

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@Carnage

So, MangaDex is no different from other aggregators in regards to respecting scanlators.

Last edited 8 mo ago by _das.

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@Carnage
"Finding the logical fallacy is left as an exercise for the student"

Look very closely

Last edited 8 mo ago by AviKav.

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@AviKav
Lack of effect doesn't often mean a lack of objection.

wat.jpg

@_das
Group restrictions were removed meaning MangaDex disregarded the group's wishes.

I honestly do not think scanlators should actually be allowed to keep stuff hostage indefinitely. Or at all, really.
I mean for fucks sake, even actual publishers lose their hold over their licenses eventually. Not to mention a publisher that actually went defunct.
Yet we as what basically amounts to pirates shouldn't? I always felt the sense of entitlement many scanlators appear to be equipped with is hilariously unreal.

I don't remember MangaDex having a right to host all scanlations. Also the highest quality scanlation? I highly doubt that. More than a few chapters were ripped from other aggregators because MangaDex was a free-for-all upload in the beginning. Not every uploader went to the original scanlation site to rip the chapters. Moreover, it is a very arduous task to go through all the uploads by other people and make sure it's the chapter you released.

Of course they don't have the right. Just like how scanlators don't actually have the right to scanlate. We are effectively pirates, after all. You might want to keep that in mind.
Also, the "in the beginning" bit kind of says it all. So I won't comment on that further.
However, I do believe I distinctively remember batoto dealing with the same problem by, well, simply letting the community report and replace chapters as needed. And it actually worked out rather well.
Of course that's significantly more difficult with groups that have a hard-on for complete control. Especially if they're dead and all that noise. ¯\_(ใƒ„)_/¯

MangaDex proudly displays One Snowshoe's discord link, despite them being "dead". They could have tried that. Alas, they only care when a group wishes to remove their uploads. For example, Easy Going Scans. They planned on removing their uploads and hadn't even contacted MangaDex staff about that when two staff members joined their discord the day after.

I have positively no idea what this paragraph is supposed to mean or allude to. :V

The whole story isn't that hard to understand. I seriously doubt that either of them didn't take the time to understand what was going on before taking action. Moreover, they went to the MangaDex discord for clarification and took action based on that. (iZN and Houdini are free to correct me if I said something incorrect).

Well, then I suggest you actually go reread what he said before: "It's still unclear so we backed away." <- Which implies that they did, in fact, not properly clarify the whole situation.
Nor did he answer my question whether they actually tried to contact MD staff through the discord, directly or at all.
So no, it actually sounds like they took a rash action based an arbitrary emotional impulse. <_<
And of course they're not actually going to correct you on that. Like, how would that even serve their narrative? That would be like actually coming out and confirming: "Yes, we're actually just throwing a temper tantrum over an inappropriate sense of entitlement and are far too stubborn and proud to admit they we may not be acting in accordance with reason."
Although I'd say that digging your heels into the ground and sticking to your guns is actually the far greater embarrassment, by this point. ¯\_(ใƒ„)_/¯

This argument is probably the dumbest one I ever hear. "By not supporting one aggregator, you are supporting other aggregators". Many groups have their own site, they're not required to "support" any aggregators.

Well, although I'm not quite sure where the "required" is coming from, it's technically not wrong. Albeit indirectly. Though I really don't think I should have actually needed to spell that bit out. <_<
But anyway. This simply goes back to a matter of user convenience. You see, people actually like being able to easily access all the content they intend to consume, from one place. Well, the utter majority anyway.
Which is why aggregators are a thing to begin with. Of course, the same applies to any other site that allows you to easily access a lot of different things from one place, such as youtube or even google. :>
And the nature of sites like these is that they're going to be more popular the more they actually allow you to access. Now, regarding what that means for aggregators x user relationships shouldn't be too difficult to figure out, but let me say it anyway: They're going to start using another one. A more complete one. A more... convenient one.
So technically speaking, saying that this will end up supporting other aggregators isn't actually wrong. Of course, only indirectly, but I said that already.

Like I mentioned before, this argument is dumb. Many active readers do read from manga.fascans.com (like they are directed to on the group page). For Android users, they can use tachiyomi or the aforementioned website.

And this counter "argument" too, basically means nothing.
Yes, I'm sure many do. But realistically speaking, an even greater number probably doesn't.
So... what of it?

@iZN
Although I can appreciate a good meme as much as the next guy, given the context of the situation, that's just coming across as hilariously childish. /o/
But no matter, I just wish you guys the best. :>
Holo
Administrator
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@iZN

And that is totally fine. Respecting all active scanlation groups include respecting those who may have opinions which differ from MD's. No active group is forced to use MD after all, as you guys have your own website.

In the event you guys change your mind in future, you will always be welcome to return.

Last edited 8 mo ago by Holo.

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I think further arguing won't change any of our position. We would like to continue keeping up with the no upload policy here. We're really sorry but this is going to be it and it's not my decision at all. So many other staff members also think the same including our leader (yes it's not me so you're arguing with the wrong person here). It does not change the fact that having our own site makes it pretty useless to have our releases maintained here as well.

About the part about Tachiyomi support, our site is supported if you download "My Manga Reader CMS" extension plus we also have a DDL archive available at mega.nz for offline reading and batch downloading.

Seriousness aside, whenever you guys mention supporting KM in any argument. We feel obliged to spread something else because at the very least that site does not say we care about scanlators:

Courtesy of our staff member

No further comment from us would be made from now on.

Last edited 8 mo ago by iZN.

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AA when?

Last edited 8 mo ago by oatmeal_.

Holo
Administrator
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Before clarification of the rules, while it was not explicitly stated, it was most certainly implied.
It was only clarified for total avoidance of doubt.
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@Holo
If anyone had an issue with this rule, MD would not have grown to the size it is today.

Lack of effect doesn't often mean a lack of objection.
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@Holo

Since day 1, the rules have stated that all scanlation is eligible for hosting on MD, with the only exception of active groups coming here to take control of their releases and remove if they want to.


I don't think MangaDex started on May 4, 2018.

New Rules Announcement: https://mangadex.org/thread/7947/major-update-site-rules-and-uploading-have-been-extensively-reworked

Old Rules: https://web.archive.org/web/20180501164643/https://mangadex.org/rules

Last edited 8 mo ago by _das.

Holo
Administrator
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Since day 1, the rules have stated that all scanlation is eligible for hosting on MD, with the only exception of active groups coming here to take control of their releases and remove if they want to. This rule exists to balance the needs of groups and readers. This is important because without groups, there are no scanlations and without readers there is no support to keep the site running.

If anyone had an issue with this rule, MD would not have grown to the size it is today.
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@Xunder

Both of your arguments don't make sense, "The rule disregards the group's members". The rule only applies to dead groups and in One Snowshoe's example, they haven't released a chapter in over a year and had group restrictions on their group to stop uploads.


Group restrictions were removed meaning MangaDex disregarded the group's wishes.

The rule is only there to make sure no scanlation goes missing, and only the highest quality scanlation to be uploaded.


I don't remember MangaDex having a right to host all scanlations. Also the highest quality scanlation? I highly doubt that. More than a few chapters were ripped from other aggregators because MangaDex was a free-for-all upload in the beginning. Not every uploader went to the original scanlation site to rip the chapters. Moreover, it is a very arduous task to go through all the uploads by other people and make sure it's the chapter you released.

One Snowshoe ... got that 7 day notice


MangaDex proudly displays One Snowshoe's discord link, despite them being "dead". They could have tried that. Alas, they only care when a group wishes to remove their uploads. For example, Easy Going Scans. They planned on removing their uploads and hadn't even contacted MangaDex staff about that when two staff members joined their discord the day after.

you never understood the whole story properly and in a fit of anger and ego that you could lock uploads, did that and stopped uploading for a rule that doesn't apply to your group in anyway.


The whole story isn't that hard to understand. I seriously doubt that either of them didn't take the time to understand what was going on before taking action. Moreover, they went to the MangaDex discord for clarification and took action based on that. (iZN and Houdini are free to correct me if I said something incorrect).

You deciding not to upload to MangaDex is another way of supporting aggregators (KissManga) who upload any series regardless of group delays or group's wishes for the series to not be uploaded on said websites


This argument is probably the dumbest one I ever hear. "By not supporting one aggregator, you are supporting other aggregators". Many groups have their own site, they're not required to "support" any aggregators.

Saying people can read off our site is a small minded view point as you disregard all the mobile users that have manga apps that automatically update their manga library and/or download any new updates


Last I checked, Tachiyomi supports Fallen Angels's site.

I'm saying all of this as your active readers that did read from the site or from their phone offline, now had to move to another aggregator to get the chapters from.


Like I mentioned before, this argument is dumb. Many active readers do read from manga.fascans.com (like they are directed to on the group page). For Android users, they can use tachiyomi or the aforementioned website.

Last edited 8 mo ago by _das.

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@iZN @Houdini Both of your arguments don't make sense, "The rule disregards the group's members". The rule only applies to dead groups and in One Snowshoe's example, they haven't released a chapter in over a year and had group restrictions on their group to stop uploads. The rule is only there to make sure no scanlation goes missing, and only the highest quality scanlation to be uploaded. One Snowshoe knew they never released a chapter in over a month, got that 7 day notice and still never contacted any mod about it. In a fit of not wanting to understand the rule, both of you (houdini and iZN) went to the discord server to rage on the rule, even though you never understood the whole story properly and in a fit of anger and ego that you could lock uploads, did that and stopped uploading for a rule that doesn't apply to your group in anyway.
You deciding not to upload to MangaDex is another way of supporting aggregators (KissManga) who upload any series regardless of group delays or group's wishes for the series to not be uploaded on said websites and they profit on your releases with their ads and lower image quality. Saying people can read off our site is a small minded view point as you disregard all the mobile users that have manga apps that automatically update their manga library and/or download any new updates from the aggregators that lower your image quality so that the chapters could be read offline. Most manga readers don't even go to the scanlator's site to read manga, but go to aggregators to read the releases as that is where they know they can read from. MangaDex provides the original quality of any chapters available, if available and you choosing not to upload here is that same as a child in a fit, grow up and stop being so childish with these stupid reasons.

I'm saying all of this as your active readers that did read from the site or from their phone offline, now had to move to another aggregator to get the chapters from.
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@Plykiya
Sounds reasonable, so far. At least I can't think of anything I'd regard as immediately worthy of criticism.
And yeah, I do rather agree that the reader base is also a noteworthy part of the equation.
Glad to know I'm not actually the only one who feels that way. /o/

@iZN
If this hasn't already put your concerns to rest, then I think this should represent an excellent opportunity to actually address them.
What 'ya say, eh?
Plykiya
Public Relations
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@Carnage There seems to be confusion about this rule. So this is our attempt at clarifying it:

2.4 If a group has had no releases on MangaDex or any websites affiliated with that group for a period of 6 months, the group will be considered inactive.

2.4.1 It is possible to request a removal of inactive groups' upload restrictions.


This means that a group is considered inactive by the community standard - MangaUpdates - of 6 months of no releases. No action is automatically taken at this point. However, a member of the community may petition to have an "inactive" locked group unlocked after the 6 months should there be outstanding chapters not yet uploaded by a group.

Should this be the case we will confirm manually that the group is indeed inactive. We do this by checking their group page, Mangaupdates and by visiting their own website to look for releases. We check all three to confirm they are indeed inactive and not that they simply do not post their content to MangaDex or that Mangaupdates is out of date.

Upon receiving a valid unlock request we will post a 7 day notice on the group's page on MangaDex and send a PM to the group leader or other still active group members. An example of the notice sent: https://mangadex.org/thread/4470/1/#post_113253 . There are plans in place to add the ability to receive an email when you have an outstanding PM on the site. Which we hope will make this process even more visible in the future. If a group contacts us and let's us know they are active, but waiting on a volume release for some new raws, are busy with personal circumstances, etc, we will reject the unlock request for the time being. A group can re-claim their group at any future time. It will always be available to them.

After the 7 days notice expires we will unlock the group, remove upload restrictions and remove the members from the members section and move them to a "Former members" Hall of Fame in the group's description. This is done to prevent the re-locking of a group, deleting chapters, or even sabotaging already uploaded chapters. There are also plans to change how we handle removing members. Instead of removing members we hope to add a feature to toggle the activity of a group to inactive. This would leave the members in place, but lock access to group controls - should a group become active again they would simply have to nudge us to change the status back to active.

We are completely open to exemptions being made for content. For example, if a group absolutely does not want a series to be hosted due to it being licensed we will honour that request. Simply let us know.

Regarding the example at hand, in the case of One Snowshoe, we still haven't been contacted by any of their members about removing any particular chapters that they don't want on MangaDex, nor have we received a reply to the notification PM we sent.

As for why rule 2.4 exists: We believe there needs to be a balance between the needs of the readers and the needs of the scanlators. MangaDex relies on not only the goodwill of active scanlation groups allowing their chapters to be uploaded, but also on an active, growing reader-base making MangaDex the best alternative for groups to reach their audiences. One of our main concerns is that if the chapters are only available on an ad-infested, malware hosting service like Kissmanga then we are forcing readers to access a site that is not beneficial to scanlators in any way, shape or form. Hosting them on MangaDex will make sure that the original group is always remembered.

The backlash against this rule was unfortunate but not wholly unexpected. Nevertheless, a compromise had to be found, and our rules reflect our best attempts at attaining one. Catering to only the needs of one side or the other would lead to the end of this site.

As soon as the site supports the full implementation of the previously described inactivity feature, rule 2.4 will be updated to reflect it.
2.4 A group that has had no new releases on MangaDex or any websites affiliated with that group for a period of 6 months is eligible by the request of any user to become marked as inactive.
2.4.1 Upon receiving an inactivation request, MangaDex staff will attempt to contact and notify the group.
2.4.1.1 It is possible for the notified group to request becoming exempt from being marked as inactive [for a period of up to 2 months].
2.4.1.2 If the group is not exempted, it will be marked as inactive after 2 weeks from the initial notification.
2.4.2 An inactive group will have all of its upload restrictions lifted and its leader and members will no longer have automatic editing and deleting permissions to the chapters associated with the group.
2.4.3 Should the group resume releasing new content, it will no longer be considered inactive and the normal permissions will be restored.

Last edited 8 mo ago by Plykiya.

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@ixlone
No matter then.
But seeing how you're already here and all, could you shed some light on this whole group clearing out business?
Teasday
Developer
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When Mangadex refuses to act like the quality police and not instantly trash this random group's work despite the fact that most of the people don't like it and it's getting a fraction of the original's views, I don't understand how you draw the conclusion that therefore MD doesn't care about groups and is all about the views. Maybe it's just me but that seems like the polar opposite of what happened.
ixlone
Administrator
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@Carnage

Tarage is incorrect. Seems he jumped in the channel and joined the bandwagon without actually reading what was happening:




He spoke to us and was totally cool with us... Even thanked us.

Real scanlators are nice.
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@Carnage Of fucking course it was the MangaDex discord and staff. They have been pulling this shit for a while. See https://mangadex.org/title/23569/gokushufudou-the-way-of-the-house-husband

See all those "colored" chapters? The dude who did this ripped the scanlator's scans without their permission. The group asked that they be taken down and MD said "lol nah". They're after views, not protecting scanlators.

Real scanlators don't give a shit about views. This is a hobby to us.
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@iZN
Whose discord? The discord of that group that was cleared out or the MangaDex discord? And if the latter, was the MD staff even involved? As in, someone who can actually take responsibility?
And "unclear" doesn't sound convincing either.
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@Carnage: They were cleared out and yes, we had a lot of discussion about this whole thing already at their Discord. It's still unclear so we backed away.

Last edited 8 mo ago by iZN.

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@iZN
Yeah, I just kinda zeroed in on that one first, because, you know, just making sure that wasn't the real story behind this...
But yeah, no way that's the case. I mean hey, that wouldn't even make sense. Just no way. /o/

That said, I'm not even exactly sure what that means. "They cleared out" or "They were cleared out"? Did you actually try and contact staff to confirm? Heck, did they actually contact staff about it, to make sure that wasn't just some sort of server hiccup or other random accident? Like, this site is still basically a construction site. And from what I gathered, they haven't even fully established most of the infrastructure necessary to deal with most issues that could potentially crop up. And even less so in a speedy manner.
So I dunno, but for now, that doesn't exactly make for a tangible piece of information. ¯\_(ใƒ„)_/¯

Beyond that, one could still argue about whether any of this happening to your group page even matters, after you've died. But I won't get into that one.
But honestly, I think that would actually make for a bigger hassle to the dex team, as they basically have to go reorganize everything every time a group reenters active status again.
It just kinda seems like hilariously huge waste of time. And if they simply choose to not do that then, well... before long, they're gonna have a very big mob of very angry scanlators at their doorsteps. ¯\_(ใƒ„)_/¯
And I don't know, but I'd figure they'd at least be smart enough to keep up appearances. /o/

Last edited 8 mo ago by Carnage.

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@Carnage ... whatever you say m8. I wasn't even talking about the upload restrictions, read my first paragraph from the previous message again. We don't want to get removed from our own group.

This site considers themselves that they care about all scanlators. I don't think so. Fancy features doesn't makes it any better either. Even batoto had more control on your group stuff except for upload restrictions which I don't even care about. This upload restriction was made waaay back then because people kept uploading the first version of our chapters where their might be some errors that we quickly fix. I didn't want to reupload all the time because some people just can't wait.
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@Houdini
Okay. :V
I'm just saying your reasoning is, at least from what you've said so far, asinine and frankly makes you kind of look like a halfwit. ¯\_(ใƒ„)_/¯
But... you do you, man. You do you.

@iZN
If your time is actually that precious, why would you ever need to care about upload restrictions in the first place? Just leave random people to upload however they want and stop caring. What's with all the fussing.
that would mean we're just wasting our personal time to upload here while there's a potential once we die it'll be all for naught cuz of random policing. we have more freedom on our own site.
Wait, am I reading this right? You actually want people to keep caring about your upload restrictions once your group is long dead? You gotta be kidding me, my dude. Like, I have to be misreading this. There is no way you think you're actually that entitled. As, no matter how much we try to sugercoat it, we're still fucking pirates. You still totally remember that and aren't actually that shameless, right? Please? Oh gawd, please let me just be wrong about this. I really don't want to have read that correctly...

Last edited 8 mo ago by Carnage.

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@Carnage: it happened with a group I personally know. they don't mention it is the whole argument, the whole rule thing is very ambiguous. the group can be considered dead, all members cleared out and not to be of concern to dex team which makes it a whole lot of a shitty concept.

they want to be another aggregator, they can keep being one. that would mean we're just wasting our personal time to upload here while there's a potential once we die it'll be all for naught cuz of random policing. we have more freedom on our own site.

Last edited 8 mo ago by iZN.

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You guys can say what you want, but we WON'T UPLOAD HERE ANYMORE. Since the get go we didn't wanted to be uploaded here, that's all.
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@Houdini
>had no activity on MangaDex or any websites affiliated with that group for a period of 4 month
>any
Impressive reading comprehension you've got there. :V
I mean dude, use your brain for at least half a minute! If that actually meant what you seem to think it does, what would this little hissy fit of yours even do?
Let me give you a little spoiler: NOOOOOTHIIIIIIIING
After 4 months, people could simply go back to uploading your stuff and that would be the end of that.
But you know, at this point I can't help but hope that's precisely what it means.
we don't need to waste our time to upload nothing here

If that was ever a factor, why care about upload restrictions to begin with?!
I mean Jesus fucking Christ...

And just so you know, as a scanlator myself but more importantly as a reader, I only ever go to a groups site to read the latest chapter when there is a reasonable delay policy in place and I'm in the middle of a reading binge.
A no upload policy though? I just go to another aggregator. Way more convenient.


@iZN
That rule also gets your owner access revoked, members deleted.

Really? Where does it actually say that though?

Edit: It's actually 6 months now. ¯\_(ใƒ„)_/¯

Last edited 8 mo ago by Carnage.

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I guess he right answer to this idiotic behaviour would be to follow their releases (and only their) on kissmanga or whatever it was called.
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@Houdini

1st party traffic is not going to change from using MangaDex, you're instead trying to reduce the support of less responsible manga aggregators that are just scraping your site. Saying you're gaining nothing is pretty short sighted, but all up to you guys.
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Yeah, I know about traffic, just Houdini mention it right. 80% Traffic cames of from reddit and 20% from others. " gain nothing by uploading our scanlations here"
.
On the other case Antonius, say is right too "Actually if you use this site correctly, it does drive more traffic to your page".
There is similar case with Jaiminis Box. They stopped upload here in span 3 months due revenue traffic. But their traffic down to 30%. So they revoke their rules and upload here again with delay 2 weeks.
.
Edit : Well, the decision still in your hands.

Last edited 9 mo ago by CoolOtamegane.

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@Houdini
Actually if you use this site correctly, it does drive more traffic to your page. Unlike most other sites, this one follows scanlators requests for delayed posting. We see that there's a new chapter and are directed to your site to read it or wait. That drives at lease some people to your site.
There's also people like me who don't have time to check a hundred different scanlators sites for new releases, hence why we use sites like this. I just use an RSS aggregator to let me know of updates and read them whenever I have a spare 5 minutes. By not uploading here, all you've done is drive me and probably others to another site that doesn't care about you guys and your rules.

By not uploading to sites like this one, while you aren't taking enough of a loss to care (Even I realize it's not much of a difference), no one wins.

Last edited 9 mo ago by Antonius.

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@Antonius The rule applies to inactive groups that haven't released a new chaptr in the span of 4 months, not necesarilly here, but just in general no chapter has been released on their site, madokami, torrets etc.
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MEMES MEMES MEMES

Last edited 8 mo ago by Houdini.

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Okay, I understand why you guys don't like that rule as it would have been better to only have the rule apply to groups that have stopped putting out new scanlations, not just stopped uploading them here (Retiring, disbanding etc.). But you guys do realize where your website traffic comes from, right? It's from sites like this where people go to read those works. To stop uploading here is basically shooting yourself in the foot, or maybe the big toe at least. Plus according to their rules, as long as you're uploading stuff you don't even have anything to worry about. And now if you don't upload anything for a few months, other people will just start uploading it in your place. Instead of refusing to upload here, which kinda looks like the lady at walmart shouting "I'm never shopping here again!" and walking out, why not discuss it with the site owner? I've emailed him a few times about things and he's been fairly receptive. Or start a post in the forums, a petition for other scanlation groups to add themselves to in the comments. Because right now, all you've accomplished is nothing by doing this.
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@iZN If you're a group that hasn't released any manga scanlation in the past few months, you'd be considered as an inactive group by lots of readers and would want the group's releases to be uploaded onto the site to fill in gaps and have a way to let chapters be read and not lost throughout time. Another point is, you'd rather have your series uploaded to a site that doesn't profit off any releases and only acts as an archive that acnowledges the scanlation group and actually uses the full quality releases given by the scanlator and if there is a time delay for other sites to host, it respects that instead of other sites that rip straight away without caring for the scanlator's wishes.
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@Mukuro It doesn't matter if it applies or not. It's stupid. That rule also gets your owner access revoked, members deleted.
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The banner doesn't prove anything, infact it helps other groups take notice of the rule. I don't get why you stopped uploading eventhough the rule doesn't apply to your group in any way.
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@Rygdar nah we good, just read it on our site.
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Why have you stopped uploading?

Please upload again.
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@Bentoki: well i have already read on their site, but i fell sorry for others that only use this site not knowing that it already updated. That's why i make that request. And thank you for iZN for uploading it.
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Could just read on their site
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pls upload Plunderer here?
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Apology for the late uploads. More things are up and also we're having new recruitment phase, if you're interested please apply!

Last edited 1 year ago by MangaDex.

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gud gud color
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Could you upload Hinomaru ch 161 and 162?
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upload chapter 5 of jigokuraku ):<